[Soleluv]

I really thought preconditioning was for DC fast charging, a lvl 1 or 2 charger would not take advance of the preheated battery. Also for how small our batteries are preconditioning I would image could use most of the range we do have.

I have my Wall Connector plugged in while preconditioning my cabin and my battery, and it works well. At about -10 degrees Celcius, it takes about 7-8% SOC to commute from home to work, but it takes only 5% if I preheat the battery.
I have a Model Y RWD, bought it right after cancelling my CX-90 PHEV GT order.

 

[jmikegilchrist]

How do you preheat the battery?

 

[Italianfox]

What you are experiencing is the cold weather performance limitation of the batteries. It is not the car but a characteristic of the battery and there is nothing you or the dealer can do to fix it other than keeping it in a heated garage. This why a hybrid makes more sense than all electric. So just enjoy the car and be at peace with the reduced battery performance in cold temps. Troll the TESLA forums and you will see that their problem is far worse in cold weather. You could also contribute more to global warming!

BTW, I am an Electronic Engineer and looked into this issue before I bought my CX-90s PP. Maybe in the future when battery tech improves or there is some technological battery technology breakthrough (like Toyota's solid state battery) i would be ready to buy an all electric. But for the foreseeable future I will will stay with the hybrid configuration and just live with the cold weather battery limitations.

My Son-in-law has a PHEV Jeep Grand Cherokee and when he tows his snowmobile + trailer in cold weather he is lucky to get 5 miles on battery. More often than not the e drive doesn't work at all.

YMMV

 

[Soleluv]

What you are experiencing is the cold weather performance limitation of the batteries. It is not the car but a characteristic of the battery and there is nothing you or the dealer can do to fix it other than keeping it in a heated garage. This why a hybrid makes more sense than all electric. So just enjoy the car and be at peace with the reduced battery performance in cold temps. Troll the TESLA forums and you will see that their problem is far worse in cold weather. You could also contribute more to global warming!

BTW, I am an Electronic Engineer and looked into this issue before I bought my CX-90s PP. Maybe in the future when battery tech improves or there is some technological battery technology breakthrough (like Toyota's solid state battery) i would be ready to buy an all electric. But for the foreseeable future I will will stay with the hybrid configuration and just live with the cold weather battery limitations.

My Son-in-law has a PHEV Jeep Grand Cherokee and when he tows his snowmobile + trailer in cold weather he is lucky to get 5 miles on battery. More often than not the e drive doesn't work at all.

YMMV

What are the far worse problems in the Tesla forums?
With battery preheat, I can get a very reasonable range in winter, only heating the cabin consumes a little more than usual.
The issue on the CX-90 is first it doesn't have a heat pump. Second, it doesn't allow you to choose to preheat the battery no matter if the charger is plugged in.

 

[Italianfox]

What are the far worse problems in the Tesla forums?
With battery preheat, I can get a very reasonable range in winter, only heating the cabin consumes a little more than usual.
The issue on the CX-90 is first it doesn't have a heat pump. Second, it doesn't allow you to choose to preheat the battery no matter if the charger is plugged in.

"What are the far worse problems in the Tesla forums?"

Some Teslas won't even run in extreme cold. Keeping it on a charger helps keep the battery warmer. One guy parked at O'Hare Airport in Chicago for 3 days, no available chargers but 80% charge left, to return to a completely dead car. It needed a tow to the nearest charge station. Another came out of work after 10 hours to a completely dead Tesler and had it towed to his home so he could charge it. Etc, Etc. I am not a Tesla owner and never will be. Some Tesla owners recommend that in extremely cold weather to never leave it for more than 3 or 4 hours without being hooked to a charger.

 

[Soleluv]

"What are the far worse problems in the Tesla forums?"

Some Teslas won't even run in extreme cold. Keeping it on a charger helps keep the battery warmer. One guy parked at O'Hare Airport in Chicago for 3 days, no available chargers but 80% charge left, to return to a completely dead car. It needed a tow to the nearest charge station. Another came out of work after 10 hours to a completely dead Tesler and had it towed to his home so he could charge it. Etc, Etc. I am not a Tesla owner and never will be. Some Tesla owners recommend that in extremely cold weather to never leave it for more than 3 or 4 hours without being hooked to a charger.

In extremely cold weather, of course, EVs don't work, not only Tesla. Even some ICE cars without a block heater won't work.
Parked in the Airport for 3 days, with no charger plugged in and sentry mode on, plus extreme cold weather, for sure the battery would be dead.

I am also working in the EV industry, Mazda's system engineer needs to implement at least three components/features to make the CX-90 PHEV a good PHEV:
1. Heat pump: Using resistive heating will drain the battery too fast. Then the EV range would be significantly reduced and ICE would kick in very often.
2. HV battery charge LV battery directly: This will enable/ensure preheating the battery by using the thermal system would not drain the LV battery to 0 which may trigger error messages.
3. Allow the battery to be preheated while the charger is plugged in.

Tesla has almost the best powertrain, especially the BMS. This is the key reason I bought a Model Y instead of the CX-90 PHEV GT.

 

[Cat97628]

I have my Wall Connector plugged in while preconditioning my cabin and my battery, and it works well. At about -10 degrees Celcius, it takes about 7-8% SOC to commute from home to work, but it takes only 5% if I preheat the battery.
I have a Model Y RWD, bought it right after cancelling my CX-90 PHEV GT order.

I read the post as preconditioning the battery not the cabin. Two different things.

 

[Soleluv]

I read the post as preconditioning the battery not the cabin. Two different things.

Yes, but when I use my Tesla app preheat my cabin, the battery is also preheated for best performance.

 

[anikiup]

I am so disappointed. I got mine at the end of December when it was still warm in Chicago. I have never gotten above 13 miles to the full battery charge. During the cold snap, I didn't make it out if my garage before the EV turned off, which I am ok with attributing to the ridiculously cold temps, but not considering the range when it's warmer. I'm taking it in today and I hope they can do something...

Doesn't the heater use engine and NOT battery?

 

[cx90mc]

Doesn't the heater use engine and NOT battery?

I can't answer that but batteries don't like cold and loose their efficiency anyway. Battery technology is just not there yet IMO.

 

[DefSport]

What you are experiencing is the cold weather performance limitation of the batteries. It is not the car but a characteristic of the battery and there is nothing you or the dealer can do to fix it other than keeping it in a heated garage. This why a hybrid makes more sense than all electric. So just enjoy the car and be at peace with the reduced battery performance in cold temps. Troll the TESLA forums and you will see that their problem is far worse in cold weather. You could also contribute more to global warming!

BTW, I am an Electronic Engineer and looked into this issue before I bought my CX-90s PP. Maybe in the future when battery tech improves or there is some technological battery technology breakthrough (like Toyota's solid state battery) i would be ready to buy an all electric. But for the foreseeable future I will will stay with the hybrid configuration and just live with the cold weather battery limitations.

My Son-in-law has a PHEV Jeep Grand Cherokee and when he tows his snowmobile + trailer in cold weather he is lucky to get 5 miles on battery. More often than not the e drive doesn't work at all.

YMMV

Batteries will lose capacity in cold, and sometimes mfg will create even bigger charge buffers in extreme temps, but the real hit on a CX-90 PHEV's cold weather range is the resistive heat. I have the same setup in my 2nd gen Chevy Volt, and it will chew up 40-50% of the EV range easy on a 30 F day. It's much cheaper to run the engine a bit for some cabin heat then use the battery charge to move the vehicle below about 45 F in my experience, and this is with ~12 c/kwh and $4/gal gas.

Think of it this way, you have maybe ~13 kwh available in the battery to use, and a resistive heater cranked on max for the CX-90 is probably 8-10 kW and running at 100% duty cycle in really cold temps. That means around 90 mins or so of just sitting there will use all your charge. If you actually drive, you still have that climate control draw on top of the ~ 2 miles/kwh normal driving efficiency. So go ~10-14 miles in ~30 mins to use 5-7 kWh, ~30 mins of heat will use ~4-5 kWh. That's pretty much your whole battery usable capacity with only a tiny bit of extra charge buffer at the bottom. It seems Mazda is reserving more cold temp charge buffer, so it's not surprising that even if someone is preheating and being gentle with it, they're getting closer to that 10-12 mile range in extreme cold.

A heat pump would really help, but it's rare in PHEVs given the idea is you can just run the engine for near "free" waste heat.

 

[Hope Smith]

2024 CX90 GT PHEV based in Toronto Ontario.

Picked up the car (new) in May 2024 and as of Dec 7/24, I have driven it 23,600+ km (went on multiple long road trips this Summer and Fall)

- a majority of my driving in Toronto is city street based on flat land

- I changed the oil at the dealership once so far at the 12,000 km mark

From June to November in the warmer weather a full tank will last me up to 3.75 weeks or approx 1200 km per full tank of regular unleaded summer fuel

- The car is always parked in an unheated garage

- I only use a Level 1 Charger at home but will occasionally charge at a level 2 when it's convenient

- Tire pressure is checked daily to ensure that it is a mfr standard

- I charge my battery to 100% every opportunity I get and sometimes charge multiple times a day

- I set the battery re-charge mode to High (when coasting in Hybrid mode)


Since day 1, I have been recording daily my

• battery charge capacity
• est'd EV range on full charge
• daily milage

Here is a summary of what I have so far


a) when charging with level 1 charger in warm weather, the battery charges 100% to an EV range of 48 km.

Actual EV range yield is as high as 53 km

Charging with Level 1 Charger seems to enable higher electricity/power density with the battery (vs Level 2)

b) when charging with a level 2 charger in warm weather, the battery will charge to 100% est EV range of 43 km.

Actual EV Range yield is as high as 49 km

c) Dec 2024 cooler winter weather has arrived and with level 1 charger (car in unheated garage), the battery at 100% gives an est'd EV range of 30 km

--> But,... with city driving on relatively flat land, the actual EV yield is closer to 22-24 km. This is basically half of what I would actually yield in the warmer weather

--> I often drive without heating the cabin

--> I use the heated seats/steering wheel to be more energy efficient

?? I wonder if winter fuel impacts the fuel efficiency ??

If anyone know more about the difference in fuel efficiency between summer/winter gas, I would be interested

d) I have made several road trips to the US ranging 800km - 1100 km each way and the ICE fuel efficiency has averaged approx 9.6 L/100 km on regular unleaded fuel

Other thoughts:

As it relates to the ICE/EV transmission handshake, when driving in "Normal" mode, the switching between ICE and EV his clunky and the car has difficulty deciding when driving in the city at slower speeds (35-45 km/h).

The software and/or mechanical failover system from EV--> ICE has difficulty deciding when straddling this sweet spot speed and it common for me to hear a very disturbing clunky transmission sound

On top of this, the transmission emits an odd "grinding" sound during harder (and Hard) acceleration. This is quite concerning, but the dealership says that this is normal and not an issue

Overall thoughts

• I originally wanted to buy the Toyota Grand Highlander but due to supply restraints and my planned summer travel to the US, I purchased this CX90 PHEV instead
• Overall I have been extremely happy with the CX90 PHEV performance, utility and efficiency
• based on my driving profile, I think I am the ideal PHEV customer who can regularly charge the car during the day. I estimate that my weekly driving is 40%-70% EV
• ICE fuel efficiency on long road trips is very reasonable for such a large vehicle, but I know that the Toyota Hybrid system is significantly superior
• the 3rd row seating is larger than all the Video Reviews I watched before I bought it. Its smaller than the Toyota GH but is more than adequate for anyone needing a 3rd row.
• I wish there was more front seat storage space for phones, cables, wallet, etc..

I hope this helps

 

[cx90mc]

winter blend fuels yield less MPG than summer blend fuel. On a gas car that gets 20 MPG you drop maybe 2 MPGs. (just an estimate for example).
Cold weather makes batteries less efficient. Driving without heat is not what many would consider acceptable. Getting 30 MPG range in my MEHV and I blast the heat, LOL.

 

[elgreco]

How is any of this OK?
Only 12 miles range on a full charge?
on top of that the cx90 refuses to engage EV mode and shows 0 EV range with almost 50% battery capacity?

 

[elgreco]

full electric charges are getting me 8 miles of range (and then once halfway down on battery it switched to zero miles range (with half battery charge remaining).......

anyone else getting this? It is making my "EV Driving" useless in winter- this is even at 35-40 degrees out with seat warmers off and climate control set at a very painful 62 degress.

 

[jdsky]

Bottom line is batteries and cold don't mix and Mazda is being conservative with the battery system in the PHEV to maintain reliability. If I lived in a warm climate I would look more closely at a plug in or EV but weather and our charging network here is just not ready for primetime electric yet.

I actually wish Mazda had an option for a CX90 with no MHEV system, no stop start and would gladly give up the slight performance and fuel economy for simplicity and reliability.

 

[Dave277]

If you can charge your car in a heated environment, it will make all the difference. I live in NY, it currently gets down to the teens at night and my garage isn't heated. I woke up to a 100% charge at 19 miles. In the summer it reads 31 miles.